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This forum is a lobbying place for MUN delegates to get prepared for the actual SalMUN 2009 Conference in Bahia!


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Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC]

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1 Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 11th 2009, 11:28

Delegates, first of all I'd like to apologize for my absency on the forum. I had a lot of work going on over the past few days and really didn't have time to assist you guys. With that being said, lets talk about Immigration. From now on post here your questions and opinions related to immigration.




  • SOME BACKGROUND ON IMMIGRATION




    -Europe is loosing its social and cultural hegemony
    .
    -Researches show that 20 years from now more than 2/3 of all the European population will be Muslim (Europeans are not happy with that at all)
    .
    -In many European Countries, specially on Italy and Spain, jails have a higher percent of foreigners prisioners serving sentences/wating for trial, than of legal citizens. For example 30,000 out of 50,000 prisioners currently serving sentences on italian jails are foreigners.
    .
    -The number of illegal immigrants entering in Europe through Italy doubled in the first seven months of 2009 compared with the same period from last year.
    .
    -Six out of the top 10 countries with the highest number of immigrants residing on them are European countries.
    .
    -MORE THAN 40 MILLION IMMIGRANTS ARE CURRENTLY LIVING ON EUROPE AND MORE THAN HALF OF THEM ARE ILLEGAL! LETS CHANGE THAT!




  • WHAT WILL HAPPEN IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING?




NOTE:Be aware that the European Population IS AGING and the need for qualified workers is vital.
.
-In 50 years there will be more immigrants and immigrants descendents living on Europe than pure real Europeans. (be careful on wording here. I assume you don't want to seem racist...congrats for the well-organized post -- Oscar)
.
-Illegal immigrants who seek for a better life and have no job qualification nor education, and are coming mostly from Northern Africa will continue to do so, will boost Europe's poverty rate.
.
-Europe's economy will sunk, since the illegal immigrants have no job qualification and the current European population is aging, there will be less people working, in which will result not only in a Economic crisis but also a very high unnemployment rate
.
-Since Europe plays a great role on the world's economy, a crise in Europe's economy will worsen the Economic Crise which is going on in the world

.





  • WHAT ARE WE PROPOSING



NOTE: I will not enter in details in this part because that is what the MUN conference is for.
.
-Create a perfect Integration system which will aply for all the EU members, and will only integrate immigrants who are qualified for a job and speak the language of the country fluently.
.
-Create permanent border control bases at the borders of Spain, France and Italy to dimish and stop the flow of immigrants coming everyday from Northern Africa, specially Marroco, Algeria and Tunisia.
.
-Incorporate a perfect system of integration limited only to entrepreneurs who are whishing to open business in Europe, with special requirements.


CONCLUDING
.

That is it fellows, i apreciate the fact that you tried to make my topic go on while i was absent, but there are somethings that only the delegate of the country can take care of. For any questions on specific things related to immigration in Europe, please post here, and i'll be more than glad to answer your questions. I didn't have time to go over this post, so i apologize for any grammar, spelling or ponctuation mistakes.
.
Thats it delegates, you guys are great and I LOVE THIS THING RIGHT HERE!
.
See you,
.
Marcelo Araujo

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2 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 12th 2009, 08:43

Please delegate, specify what you are trying to do,
since you yourself have not stated what the delegation of Germany wants to accomplish, the delegation still find your topic very brod. For banning all forms of peoples from coming into the nation will make no sense. state please the main decision in your resolution, to try and clear up what many delegates have said.

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3 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 12th 2009, 08:45

How will you create a PERFECT system, as Russia has many experience in MUN, it finds it hard to believe that Germany, has perfected a way to rid the problem, for what seems perfect to one, may be worse for others. think not only of yourself but of fellow nations as well, for in order for this resolution to pass, you will have to find a way to benefit others as well.

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4 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 12th 2009, 09:03

German Delegate,
Let me see if I got this right: you will increase borders patrol, and establish a system set by your desired rules. There are countries across Europe mainly in eastern Europe that is suffering from deacreasing population, and immigration from other countries is an excelent way to bring cheap labor, which by the way includes your country. By establishing your "perfect" integration system (which by by the way you didn't specify the requirements) what makes you think that the Russian delegation and other countries will agreee?Is it really "perfect" as you previously stated?
Cy'a

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5 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 12th 2009, 10:01

Delegate of Germany,
It´s clear that illegal immigration is a major problem in Europe, which includes the countries of France, Italy, Germany and others. The delegate should be more specific about the topic. What are the major goals to combat illegal immigration? What is this type of system that Germany wants to establish? How much money would be spent on the border patrols and how much guards used? How is Germany controlling the illegal immigration?
"Europe's economy will sunk SINK, since the illegal immigrants have no job qualification "
It´s not that Europe economy is sunking SINKING, on the contrary immigrants, a high amount of immigrants are working on jobs for a cheaper labor, the problem is exactly this they are taking the jobs of Europeans and getting a lower payment, increasing a lot the number of unemployed Germans in the country.



Last edited by chaireurope_leitz on November 13th 2009, 13:01; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : john i expect some better writing from a senior! p´lease watch your spelling since you are supposed to set an example for all delegates. Raphael europe chair)

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6 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 12th 2009, 11:42

What the delegate of Russia does not understand is that, Germany in 2007 was paying for everyone that had a baby in germany, due to the underpopulation which it suffers from. Today many countries in Europe have the same problem: underpopulation, Russia also suffers from that and believes that stoping immigrants from entering thier nations would only make the situation worst.

gemany have you considered that before chosing your resolution?

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7 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 12th 2009, 20:02

To Delegate Jaap:

"Please delegate, specify what you are trying to do,
since you
yourself have not stated what the delegation of Germany wants to
accomplish, the delegation still find your topic very brod
"
Delegate, I did specified Germany's plans, what I didn't specify were the prices, the budget necessary to acomplish these goals, and minor details including some numbers because these things are to be discussed at the MUN conferences. I don't understand your anxiety.

"For banning all forms of peoples from coming into the nation will make no sense."
I invite you, delegate, to read my post one more time. Do I really want to ban all people from coming in?


To Delegate Alexandre:

"There are countries across Europe mainly in eastern Europe that is
suffering from deacreasing population, and immigration from other
countries is an excelent way to bring cheap labor, which by the way
includes your country
"
Delegate, one of my REQUIREMENTS to integrate immigrants is that they prove to be qualified to do a certain job. The fact is that poor, undeducated, old, men and women with no working habilities are coming everyday throgh illegal imigration, and THAT is what i want to stop.Why do you write things without reading?

To Delegate John

Delegate I see your point, and that is what i'm defending here. Some of your questions are answered on the topic, and some will be answered only on the conference, since there is no need to discuss certain details here. I see you're going to be a strong ally in this struggle, since France is one of the entrance points for immigrants who come into the EU.


To Delegate Maximino

"What the delegate of Russia does not understand is that, Germany in
2007 was paying for everyone that had a baby in germany, due to the
underpopulation which it suffers from.
"
I'm totally aware of this information, but lots has been done since then. In 2007, Germany adopted a fully integration system, to control the flow of the immigrants, and filter it, so it can take the ones that are really going to make a difference. Today Germany is quite settled with this issue, but the rest of the Countries in Europe are not. I'm trying to incoorporate the same system that was applied in Germany 2 years ago to the whole EU.

"Today many countries in Europe have the same problem: underpopulation,
Russia also suffers from that and believes that stoping immigrants from
entering thier nations would only make the situation worst
.
"
Really guys i'm disapointed with you. Why don't you guys read carefully? It seems like i'm writing for a bunch of illiterate. I'm going to just copy and paste what I wrote on the post okay?
- "...and will only integrate immigrants who are qualified for a job and speak the language of the country fluently"
-"Be aware that the European Population IS AGING and the need for qualified workers is vital."


See you

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8 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 12th 2009, 22:48

the delegation of Russia find it amusing how the German Delegate says

"Delegate, I did specified Germany's plans, what I didn't specify were the prices, the budget necessary to acomplish these goals, and minor details including some numbers because these things are to be discussed at the MUN conferences. I don't understand your anxiety."

Germany has in no way specified how this so called perfect plan
will work, the german delegate has only said that it will make
this plan... there is one question the delegate is forgetting, that is
HOW?


Russia does not want to know the prices, Russia wants to know what
it will be debating, for if your plan proves to be in fact, PERFECT, then
there is no reason for anyone to vote against it,


Russia challenges the delegate of Germany, to PROVE how this plan is perfect, for in our eyes, it is n
ot.

What the Russia delegate find extremely amusing is that, there will be a selecting system involved, and who will be in charge of selection? Who choses who is fit? and who choses who will be fit to be in the selecting group? basically, and endless cycle, Who will select who, who will select who, etc etc...

Basically Germany will be eliminating people because of their actions, what if a person were to be nervous, because after all, the rest of their lives would depend on being let into the country or not... and therefore, might they be sent away, what if that person had potential? Will Germany be in charge of the fate of all of these men woman and children?

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9 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 13th 2009, 13:33

delegate, i know how to read dont worry, but it seems that you dont know how to think.... Many countries in Europe, including russia needs immigrants. If you do not allow imigrants to enter our countries soon there will be a serious problem, worst than it already is. What do you think will happen if population of major nations like Russia or even GERMANY was decreased to only a couple of million people?
immigrants are importat for the population

please marcelo, read what others write and think before answering

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10 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 15th 2009, 14:42

Delegate,
Italy finds your solution too vague. Italy is in favor of this resolution yes, because italy believes illegal immigration is a serious issue that affects economy, social welfare, education, health care, slavery, prostitution,
legal protections, voting rights, public services, and human rights. Especially violations in the human rights code. Germany needs to take more effective measures if it plans on ending this issue. Italy finds that blocking immigrants passage to the country is not a very intelligent way to end such issue, because if it is so, you will be blocking the arrival of new individuals in each country. Can italy be more especific in its solution?

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11 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 15th 2009, 22:33

Yes, Italy is in favor of this resolution, since we believe that illegal immigration is a threat that affects Europe in various ways. According to the European Union estimation, about half a million illegal immigrants still enter Europe annually. Italy adopted a law in which illegal immigration will be punished with a large fine of 5,000 to 10,000 euros, and those who accommodate illegal migrants can go up to three years in prison. Illegal immigrants can also be detained up to six months or can be deported immediately. Can the delegate of Germany be more clear about its proposals?

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12 Re: Immigration [OFFICIAL TOPIC] on November 16th 2009, 20:20

People here are asking for clarity. Although I don't know how much more clear I can be, than I'm current being, I'll not complain, instead I'll clarify things to you. I'll be very direct, though.


Germany wants to build 5 bases at the coasts of France, Spain and Italy, in a total of 15 patrolling bases along Southern Europe's coast. These bases will contain a minimum of 7 patroll boats each that will be almost all the time patrolling in the water. The boats will take shifts among themselves. What these boats are going to do is: try to find and intercept crafts full of illegal immigrants coming from Africa. We're going to urge the each country mentioned above pay for the construction of the bases (in their country) as well as to guarantee fuel, radars, light vision intruments, the boats, and food supplies for the patrollers. These things together will not cost nothing greater than 1.5 million euros.


The next thing Germany is proposing is the creation of a integration system, that, as I mentioned before, will be integrating ONLY immigrants who prove to be qualified for ANY KIND of useful job. This system will be the same for ALL European Union members. This time, the United Nations will take care of most of the money involved. Someone asked "who will make the selection", and the answer for that is: employees who were recruited to work on this program (by their respective countries) will strictly follow A PROTOCOL (that will be the same for all countries), to determine if the immigrant fits in the REQUIREMENTS OF THE PROTOCOL, which are: prove to be qualified to a certain job, prove that they can fluently speak the language of the country they want to live in, and sign a document giving away their previous citizenship to adopt the new one.


The last thing that Germany is proposing is the creation of a similar integration program, ALSO FINANCIED BY THE UN, but this time, limited ONLY TO ENTREPRENEURS (BUSINESS MEN) who wish to open business in the country. Just like the other program, this one would have a series of requirements, such as: speak the language, invest at leat 100,000 euros on their business at first and provide a minimun of 5 new jobs as a result of their business.


What most UPSET me is the fact that people here are saying that Germany wants to definately close EU doors to immigrants as if I didn't know myself that Europe is facing a underpopulation issue. Come on guys, read carefully. On my opinion and i'm sure you guys agree with me now, these three solutions together, forms a combination of a perfect plan. If you're doubting, think with me:


1. Europe is going to receive only people who will boost its labour force and move it's economy foward.


2. there will be less people living in the streets and immigrants who barely speaks the language of the country they're in.


3.
More business men will be atracted to this new proposal, and will come open their business here, therefore they'll be making more jobs.


I hope you guys understood,


Germany

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